zr1 vs 360

Since the new vette vs used ferrari debate seems to garner some interest at the 45k mark. How about if you had 100k to spend. Would you go for a zr1 vette or a used 360. The 360 for sure will cost more to run, the vette will be more reliable new and cheaper to own. Two years from now they would both be used cars. The ferrari is probably beter built so wouldnt feel necessarily more used than the vette. A paddleshift ferrai may in some ways be less fun than a manual vette? On paper the vette will eclipse the 360, but is that so relevant given the performance available from either. The vette has lots of fun CF bits cermaic brakes. I dont know if you take the badging out of the vequation they both have appeal.

 

True the older farrais are great ,the moderns dont have quite the same appeal. Or put another way a modern ferrari is so "usable" that its not so different to a number of other cars out there. The 360 is not a classic yet, its not the pinnacle. the zr1 is the pinnacle of its type at the moment. Also frankly new ferraris while great have for me a negative, fashion acessory pose branded blah immage.

That this debate takes place indicates just how far the vette has come. I still think that after 20k mi it will be a lose rattletrap, but maybe that is my past GM experience comming through. The vette will not have the finesse of the ferrari either, but the pererformance appears so ridiculous that it kinda writes its own game, not sure where one would or could use it though. The vette being so extreme might also be a pinnacle in terms of overpowered cars, given that new regs are going to make new cars smaller lighter less powerful etc. That just might make the zr1 the last of the mohecans and therefore a "collectable" for 20 years from now, cant really say the same about the 360.
In the 360's favor it really is a race car for the street, and probably rrasonable fun on the track, and hey it has that italian magic, something thayt even affects fiats. But it costs to run and has the modern ferrari stigma.

Personaly not getting rid of the boxer either way. I guess if I got 500k for it I could see having a 360 to have a ferrari. Take the train to work, Got a m3 comming of lease, was thinking of buying it, stretching to a nissan gtr. But them am so afflicted with car illness thought about stretching to another usless 2 seater in a year or so and trying for a zr1. But would it satisfy as much as a used gt3RS for the same $ and the wife is already flipping about the lotus 211 on the way, she has frivelous plans for money like house.. I like to keep cars so part of the equation wouls alawys be its future desirability. Still having fun looking though.

The question remains. If you had no hot car right now and 100k to spend would you go for a zr1 or used 360, as I said earlier the fact that it is a debate indicates how far the vette has come. A few years from now Aston will be a serious contender too. Ferrari better watch out before it becomes an automotiuve coach.

 

Well for 100k what else would you rather have?

 

Just looked at the vette forums, they seem pretty dissapointed that the car has a crappy interior still, and most want a mid engine.

 

For 100k car is not going to be a daily. Conssidder this to be a weekend blaster with occasional civillian use, and a bit of track thrown in.

 

I have a lotus 211 on the way for the track, and the boxer is a great weekend blaster. I also have a m3 which I enjoyed as a less intense alternative to the boxer, ie you put the key in and go, can park anywherer great stereo ac and can still be driven hard when the road conditions permit. In other words an everyday blaster you can take to the shops get caught in traffic in and drive long distances to a track day.

Where the M3 is a huge dissapointment is in its lack of feedback, blandness on the track in spite of performance specs. The M3 is great but not great fun. Maybe a subaru sti would be more fun. Then I got to thinking about the nissan gtr. But while the gtr specs are great too, it is probably more of a computer driven no feedback kinda car than the M3, and there is no stick reducing driver involvement further. Plus at 3800lbs a GTr is going to be seriously questionable on a track smaller than the nurbering, personaly I think it will wilt if driven hard at a track, but then so do most stock porches and ferraris.

The zo6 seems to have agreat reputation, and while it lacks in feedback and driving finesse, which on the street are major componants of enjoyment, its ridiculous power provides an entertainment of its own. The Zr1 with its carbon fiber bits cermamic brakes and supercar power/performance at least makes a case for itself as being superlative in a number of areas, which makes it appealing.

But that is just me, assuming you did not have another "sportscar" and had 100k to spend. The car might have some daily use here and there but it is assumed you have a daily driver so this is to be a fun car. In this case would you as a hypothetical buyer go for the zr1 or a 360 or say a carrera c2s. My interest in the debate is that at this price range, which is well above where avtte is traditionaly priced the zr1 may huve pluses and minuses but it is a contender, and depending on where you place emphasis a great choice.

I believe that between 1970 and say the 04 zo6 the performance chasm between a ferrari and a vette for the same money was so huge there was no comparisson to make. The ferrai would have had significantly greater performance and durability at speed on the track etc, it would also have been significantly more painful to live with.

Today a 360 is relatively civilised, maybe more expensive to maintain but unlikely to leave you stranded, at least as comfortable as the vette and arguable more fun in certain parameters. The vette is less expensive to run, cruder, but on paper has a performance if not a fun to drive edge. This means that the gap that ferrari enjoyed has been significantly narrowed, and as ferraris become more civilised while vettes astons etc develop better power handling interiors etc the gap will narrow futher with ferraris main points of differentiation being design(although they have no monopoly on this particularily with aston) brand image(sadly a weak fallback for something as great as ferrari) and italian passion(something like charm impossible to just copy but real nevertheless.)

I would say ferrari having essentialy invented the upscale hyperperformance drivable status sportscar is seeing its market assulted from porche audi aston etc. Ferraris response is limited production brand mangement so newer cars are now mainly going to people who covet them as fashion acessories. Evo picked the gt3rs above the scuderia because it felt fully developed from a lineage wheras the scuderia felt contrived. For a "brand" to survive and prosper it also has to have integrity. Ferrari imho should be building cars both for the fashionistas
and still be building 100-150k cars for the hardcore. Porche does this and each gt3 driven balls out at a trackday gives credibility to the carreras and convertables etc. Ferrari can protect and enhance its brand image by having more production in more subniches.

As it is hardcore track people can buy a lotus which is a lot of money for what it is or a gt3, try get a scuderia let alone drive one in anger. On the fashion front you have aston and even audi makes an exotic.

The vettes have comparatively little status yet the very existance of this thread proves that they have established real credibiliy. And real credibility(at least that is aceeasible) is a diminishing attribute of ferraris. When aston finaly gets a real engine and a bit beter build, possibly even a mid engine, not to mention a reasonably priced maclaren where will ferrari be. I think they are in great danger unless they seriously start covering a wider range of sportscar niches to both satify fashionistas and DRIVERS and preserve their hardcore image(which by the way is related to who drives them, how they are driven and where) Frankly when ferrari falls from fashion(which it surely will) will it still have relevance or will a number of companies have occupied that role.