1981 QP III 5 Speed and 1986 QP III Auto | Page 13 | FerrariChat

1981 QP III 5 Speed and 1986 QP III Auto

Discussion in 'Maserati' started by William Abraham, Nov 27, 2010.

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  1. William Abraham

    William Abraham Formula Junior

    Nov 21, 2010
    830
    London, UK
    Full Name:
    William Abraham
    #301 William Abraham, Mar 21, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  2. William Abraham

    William Abraham Formula Junior

    Nov 21, 2010
    830
    London, UK
    Full Name:
    William Abraham
    #302 William Abraham, Mar 21, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  3. William Abraham

    William Abraham Formula Junior

    Nov 21, 2010
    830
    London, UK
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    William Abraham
    #303 William Abraham, Mar 21, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Well - a bit of a heartbreaker. The electrical repairs I had done were all rubbish and Prestige had to redo them all. Thank God they were able to sort it. They then rebuilt the 4 carbs and got it running sweetly BUT then noticed a problem. There seems to be a very small crack in the head. So all this work painting, crackle finish, undercarriage etc and we have a crack in the head. I was going to drive it for a while but he felt that we should properly fix and arrest the crack before it became more serious. Frankly, I am a bit gutted but c'est la vie.

    We scraped the paint off so this can be seen. I thought it was just a weep of oil from the valve cover but when we tidied this all up it could be noticed.
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  4. Quattroporte3

    Quattroporte3 Formula 3

    Nov 13, 2010
    1,060
    #304 Quattroporte3, Mar 21, 2013
    What horrible luck, William.

    All that work only to discover a crack when you'd gotten it all back together. Good for you for taking care of it now instead of just letting it go.

    Hope you can find a good solution and get her running again soon!
     
  5. qp400i

    qp400i Karting

    Jun 17, 2011
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    Netherlands
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    Igino
    #305 qp400i, Mar 21, 2013
    Undeserved bad luck indeed. What can be the cause of this - tired after 30 years, overheated? Is this known to occur more often?
     
  6. Maserati Blue

    Maserati Blue Formula Junior

    Dec 13, 2010
    947
    Europe
    #306 Maserati Blue, Mar 21, 2013
    I've seen it a few times already: once in an 80's Biturbo, twice in 90's Ghibli, once in a Ghibli Cup and another in a 2000 QP IV.

    I'm not sure about the location of the crack, its been too many years and I don't remember.
     
  7. William Abraham

    William Abraham Formula Junior

    Nov 21, 2010
    830
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    William Abraham
    #307 William Abraham, Mar 22, 2013
    Hi I am sure some of the motor experts here will have a view but the 4.9 motor I am sure I have read is a bit prone to eating its head gaskets and certainly in the QPIII to overheating. Usually this is caused by the fans not kicking in either due to the fuse box issue or the connector on the radiator. Any QPIII should/must have a manual switch put in the cubby under the steering wheel to manually turn on the fans if they are not kicking in.

    Now is this the cause? Don't know for sure. Prestige just said its not uncommon and its is 30 years old so seemed to be pointing to an inherent weakness. The crack is between the two valve cover gaskets in the valley just in front of the rearmost spark plug.
     
  8. GLB

    GLB Formula Junior

    Oct 27, 2010
    303
    Dallas, TX
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    George Lawrence Brantingham
    #308 GLB, Mar 22, 2013
    The engines are completely different, so that experience is not relevant anyway.
     
  9. staatsof

    staatsof Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    #309 staatsof, Mar 22, 2013
    Oil from a crack there?

    It's been so long since I worked on the old V8 that I don't remember what's behind there? Coolant I thought ???

    Check very carefully before pulling that head.

    Is the oil coming down from that valve cover but seeping under the paint?

    You're right there so it's just a thought ...
     
  10. William Abraham

    William Abraham Formula Junior

    Nov 21, 2010
    830
    London, UK
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    William Abraham
    #310 William Abraham, Mar 22, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2013
    I thought it was oil but it is coolant against the black crackle paint although at the very top it looks like oil. I don't see any other option but to pull it. I can do the valves etc at the same time so what I will do is the top of the motor in the car as it is still running perfectly strong.
     
  11. William Abraham

    William Abraham Formula Junior

    Nov 21, 2010
    830
    London, UK
    Full Name:
    William Abraham
    #311 William Abraham, Mar 25, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  12. bundas

    bundas F1 Veteran
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    Dec 31, 2005
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    mitchell barnes
    #312 bundas, Mar 26, 2013
    hopefully your income stream will survive these restorations. really beautiful jogs. all of maserati thank u
     
  13. Quattroporte3

    Quattroporte3 Formula 3

    Nov 13, 2010
    1,060
    #313 Quattroporte3, Mar 28, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Delivered my car last night. You can just see William's in the background. Sorry for the poor picture quality and compositional mistakes, it was late, I was tired and all I had was my phone.

    In Cardiff now getting ready to return to London.

    Looking forward to following the progression. Should I start a new thread, or continue the other "bare metal respray" one, or put pics on the "QP3 catch all thread"?
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  14. staatsof

    staatsof Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    #314 staatsof, Mar 28, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2013
    Oh well. I was hoping it would make things easier but if it is coolant it's welding time.

    I think you might be able have that crack welded if it's just in that area without having to disassemble the head and do a valve job. Ask a good engine re-builder whose done plenty of crack welding about that. It might not cause the rest of the head to distort if it's done properly? Done in place? Ask.
     
  15. Jalpa_Mike

    Jalpa_Mike F1 Rookie

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    #315 Jalpa_Mike, Mar 28, 2013
    I sure miss the 'ole girl!!! Can't wait to follow your progress!!!!

    Mike
     
  16. William Abraham

    William Abraham Formula Junior

    Nov 21, 2010
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    William Abraham
    #316 William Abraham, Mar 28, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  17. William Abraham

    William Abraham Formula Junior

    Nov 21, 2010
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    William Abraham
    #317 William Abraham, Mar 28, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    My car was Blu Sera. ALSA are asking me to finalise the colour choice and recommended this RR Silver as seen on this MG. Not sure......

    "I thought it was time we cleaned everything off and changed the masking as it was becoming a little ragged, also detail stripping completed on right hand rear door apeture, all around rear lamps, rear valence etc, so just the remaining three door shuts, engine bay reveal and upper engine bay left to do. As expected no problems found."
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  18. William Abraham

    William Abraham Formula Junior

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    #318 William Abraham, Mar 28, 2013
    Great. Did you get a look at mine when you were there or were you too tired? Anyway, it seems to be QP III central!!! I think you should have your own thread for this as I would like to follow it with car. The Catch All thread seems to be working for various bits but this should have its own. Frankly, the site administrators could have some breakdown under Maserati and give Quattroporte's their own sub-site so for now start one!!!
     
  19. Jalpa_Mike

    Jalpa_Mike F1 Rookie

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    #319 Jalpa_Mike, Mar 28, 2013
    That's a beautiful color on that MG!

    Mike
     
  20. bundas

    bundas F1 Veteran
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    Dec 31, 2005
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    #320 bundas, Mar 28, 2013
    is cold weld an option?
     
  21. Quattroporte3

    Quattroporte3 Formula 3

    Nov 13, 2010
    1,060
    #321 Quattroporte3, Mar 29, 2013
    I did indeed look over your car while I was there William, going to cherry pick all the best bits and have them put on my car :p, lol.

    QP3 central indeed, I think this will be the 5th that Al does, which in my opinion puts him at an advantage. Many competent body shops can do a bare metal respray, but knowing the car, it's intricacies, any special or unusual details or ways things are done makes everything easier and gives a better result, as well as lets him work more efficiently.

    Your car looked really nice. Some expected rust in the usual places, around the windows and such, but all in all it looked very straight and clean. Lot's of lead, although Al assured me that was how they came from the factory. In fact, when the car is done it will be better than factory new - the slight ripples, dips and irregularities in the roof, trunk and body were standard fare and the best they could do at the time, when Al is done the car will be 100% straight and true. Perfect.

    I don't want to misrepresent Al, but if I understood him correctly, the build quality across the board for Italian exotica wasn't especially good during this era, although compared to Ferrari and Lamborghini, Maserati was a cut above in the fit and finish department, they had been doing this quite a bit longer, after all. Still nowhere near what one expects today of even the cheapest car, but cars today don't offer much soul or character.

    I was curious as to why your car was riding so high in the front, even higher than the MIE shocks and thought it was on axle stands, upon closer inspection I discovered that the motor was missing. That explains it. Hope the rebuild is going well.

    I also stopped along the way to meet with Dave the damper guy who had a look at my dampers and ride height. He concluded that the springs were a tad under-dimensioned and will have new ones ready soon that should raise the ride height the 1-2" that's missing now. I gave him my MIE springs for testing and cleanup, and will hopefully help him verify the correct spring settings, probably somewhere in between the OEM and MIE versions. We had a nice cup of tea and a good talk, he's got some amazing stories to tell and is a very experienced guy.

    Last but by no means least, I wanted to express my thanks to Al and Sarah for their hospitality and the warm welcome with which I was provided. They went out of their way to help me get the car delivered, had a hot cup of tea waiting and were more accommodating than anyone can expect. Truly lovely people, my car couldn't be in better hands.

    Work on my car is scheduled to begin on Tuesday. I may just update my QP3 blog and post the progress there to make things easier. I'm already approaching my posting limit for pictures here.

     
  22. William Abraham

    William Abraham Formula Junior

    Nov 21, 2010
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    William Abraham
    #322 William Abraham, Apr 18, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  23. William Abraham

    William Abraham Formula Junior

    Nov 21, 2010
    830
    London, UK
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    William Abraham
    #323 William Abraham, Apr 18, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    From Al

    "some more pics of the metalwork..........front right sill upper and a small patch of heavy surface corrossion on the right front doorstep ( I didn't see the point in just spot sandblasting this as the metal had obviously got very thin here) cut out & new metal welded in. just a very quick update and one picture today (but an important one nonetheless).........final area of corrossion cut out ready for new metal to go in.
    The doors should be stripped and trial fitted in a few days."
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  24. Quattroporte3

    Quattroporte3 Formula 3

    Nov 13, 2010
    1,060
    #324 Quattroporte3, Apr 19, 2013
    Nice...

    Al's attention to detail is reassuring. Mine is stripped, waiting for the glass people to pull the windshield.

    I'll ask him if he can check the headlight buckets on both of our cars to see if they're identical, as I suspect they are. That will facilitate me converting the headlights to the H4 standard from the US spec H4656 currently on the car. They don't even light the road in front of the car on main beams!
     
  25. William Abraham

    William Abraham Formula Junior

    Nov 21, 2010
    830
    London, UK
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    William Abraham
    #325 William Abraham, Apr 20, 2013
    The 86 is going through is cracked head phase and next step is the front shocks and springs. There appears to be enough front end weight difference to require two different applications for the front but we will bottom this out when my 86 goes in for its front shocks.

    Here is what David from Aurok had to say:

    "Managed to meet briefly with Thor.
    Time was tight as he was on his way to Wales.

    He had had to increase the pre load on the springs to obtain a reasonable ride height and also raise the left side more than the right. His Welsh engineer later told him that it was quite normal for the front ride heights to be different. reading through Thor's workshop manual also gave me the reason for the requirement of the increased pre load. His car is American spec and as such is about 100 kilos heavier due to the emmission systems hence he will need a slightly stiffer spring than a European spec car. I am in the proocess of obtaining a slightly stiffer and better quality spring to fit to his dampers so we will not require the increased pre load which should improve the ride quality even more.

    Thor found a great improvement in handling and had adjusted the dampers slightly softer than we had anticipated which gave a slightly better ride quality but not detract from the improved handling. Unfortunately we were both on a tight time schedule so it was not possible for me to test the car for myself.

    To sum up, we would very much like to be able to fit the dampers to your car ourselves. We can then give the car a proper road test to see if we can improve the damping characteristics even more. It should only take a couple of days and we would have 2 options of spring to try as I hope your car is Euro spec."
     
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